Naruto vs One Piece Amalgam CaV: HitTheAssassin vs GearSecond659
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Naruto vs One Piece Amalgam CaV: HitTheAssassin vs GearSecond659
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
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GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
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HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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vsw
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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#5
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GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
Posted by
SocaJunkie
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 18 days, 10 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
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- 18 days, 9 hours ago
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 13 days, 13 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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Naruto vs One Piece Amalgam CaV: HitTheAssassin vs GearSecond659
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
Posted by
vsw
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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Tag
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
Posted by
SocaJunkie
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
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HitTheAssasin
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
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Enemybird
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
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GearSecond659
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
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Chronicplane
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
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HitTheAssasin
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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Naruto vs One Piece Amalgam CaV: HitTheAssassin vs GearSecond659
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
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GearSecond659
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@hittheassasin
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#3
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HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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#5
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GearSecond659
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
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HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
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Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
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SocaJunkie
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
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HitTheAssasin
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 18 days, 10 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
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- 18 days, 9 hours ago
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
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HitTheAssasin
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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vsw
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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Tag
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
Posted by
SocaJunkie
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 18 days, 10 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
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- 18 days, 9 hours ago
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
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HitTheAssasin
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- 13 days, 13 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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vsw
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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Tag
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
Posted by
SocaJunkie
(6043 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 18 days, 10 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
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- 18 days, 9 hours ago
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 13 days, 13 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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vsw
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
Posted by
SocaJunkie
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 18 days, 10 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
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- 18 days, 9 hours ago
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
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HitTheAssasin
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- 13 days, 13 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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vsw
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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Tag
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#6
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
Posted by
SocaJunkie
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#14
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HitTheAssasin
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#15
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Enemybird
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
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GearSecond659
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
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#17
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Chronicplane
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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#18
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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#1
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GearSecond659
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
#1
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 26 days, 13 hours ago
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HITTHEASSASSIN'S BUILD
Body: Kurama
Skill: Killer Bee.
Jutsu: Obito's Kamui.
Kekkai Genkai: Madara's EMS
GEARSECOND659'S BUILD
Body: Big Mom
Skill: Rob Lucci
Devil Fruit: Whitebeard
Haki: Katakuri
RULES
- Anime and Manga Feats
- Fight Until K.O. or Death
- Fighters Start 20 Feet Apart
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#2
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GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#2
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GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
#2
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@hittheassasin
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#3
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HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#3
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HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
#3
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 26 days, 12 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Interesting indeed. I'm very much looking forward to seeing what you're strategy is and how this'll play out.
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#4
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#4
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- 26 days, 11 hours ago
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Tag
#4
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Tag
#4
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
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- 26 days, 10 hours ago
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@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
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#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 26 days, 10 hours ago
- Show Bio
@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 26 days, 10 hours ago
- Show Bio
@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
#5
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 26 days, 10 hours ago
- Show Bio
@hittheassasin:Sorry this is on the early side, but I have been wanting forever to do this style CaV. So without further adieu, let's get started :)
THE BODY - BIG MOM
PHYSICALS
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
THE SKILL - ROB LUCCI
ROKUSHIKI TECHNIQUES
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
THE DEVIL FRUIT - WHITEBEARD
GURA GURA NO MI
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
THE HAKI - CHARLOTTE KATAKURI
HAKI
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
CONCLUSION
Thus, my build wins for the following reasons
- Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
- The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
- The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
- Katakuri's Observation Haki allows Big Mom foresight and gives her the perfect counter to any hax my opponent's build may try and pull out
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
One of the main reasons I chose Big Mom as the body for this Amalgam CaV is because she is the most well rounded One Piece character when it comes to stats, boasting very high strength, durability, and big shocker: speed.
To give you a baseline for how strong Big Mom is, at the age of 5, she broke the bones of a giant just by fitting his arm. And this was as a toddler!
She was even able to tank a sword slash from the strongest Giant in Elbaf before killing him by slamming him into the ground by the beard.
For reference, Hajurdin, a far weaker Giant, was able to tank several blows from and punch a ten thousand ten opponent a far distance away, so the fact that Big Mom not only blocked an attack from the STRONGEST Giant, but also one shotted him is very impressive, especially when you consider that she did it AT THE AGE OF 5 (while Hajurdin did fall unconscious, the fact that he tanked several ten thousand tonner blows before he went unconscious and the fact that Big Mom one shotted a much stronger Giant is impressive). So imagine the power that Big Mom has as an adult.
To give you an idea for how strong a fully grown up Big Mom is, without her Armament Haki, Big Mom can CASUALLY cancel out a Gear Third strike from Luffy and no sell a kick from Sanji coming from the side.
For reference, Gear Third Luffy smashed through a gargantuan, thick metal door and Sanji before Diable Jambe and before he acquired Haki, was able to kick a creature hundreds of tons in weight, several feet into the air. And Big Mom canceled out both of these attacks CASUALLY, implying that she can tank much, much more.
Lastly, we arrive at speed, and contrary to what many may assume, Big Mom is actually pretty damn fast. She was able to react to and block an attack from Gear 4th Luffy. For reference, PRE TIMESKIP BASE Luffy was capable of punching lightning out of the air, and this was a pre timeskip, base Luffy, so it is likely that Gear 4th Luffy can move even faster. And Big Mom reacted to it just the same, making her MHS + is reaction speed.
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
I'm sure you know where I am going with this. Rob Lucci is one of the most skilled One Piece characters, but not in the traditional sense. Because we all know that in the One Piece world, there is no such thing as normal martial arts. No, Rob Lucci is the most skilled in the sense that he is a master of the mystical martial art of Rokushiki, a martial art that grants the wielder superhuman abilities. With Rob Lucci as my skill, that means that Big Mom has access to all of Rob Lucci's techniques afforded to him under extensive training with the Rokushiki style of combat, and she can perform said techniques with the same level of proficiency and level of ability as Rob Lucci himself, which is very beneficial, especially in this fight, as I will get into later on.
Oh and in case you don;t believe that Rokushiki is a martial art, well, it was literally stated to be one sooo...
Note that while Rob Lucci doesn't have on screen showings for all of the Rokushiki Techniques, he does have mastery over each and every technique, having mastered each of them "to the extreme."
With that said, let's get into Lucci's techniques.
First, there is Kamie, a technique that allows Lucci to contort his body to be as thing as paper and is very useful for dodging attacks. Notice how even at point blank range, Blueno was still able to use Kamie to remain completely untagged by Luffy. This could be put to good use given Big Mom's insane reaction speed.
But the most prominent defensive technique that Lucci uses is Tekkai, which increases Lucci's durability tenfold by hardening his body, With this, Rob Lucci NO SOLD a Gatling attack from Luffy. Now Tekkai increases ones durability, hardening their body. It allowed Rob Lucci, who would normally take damage from a basic punch from Luffy in a much stronger form, to completely no sell one of Luffy's most powerful attacks. Thus, usign Tekkai, Big Mom can further increase her already impressive durability to insane levels should the situation call for it.
Now for more offensive techniques, there is first the Shigan. With this, Rob Lucci can use his finger as a piercing weapon, stabbing through flesh like it is butter. Rob Lucci was even able to use a Shigan to casaully pierce thorugh very thick metal. It is also worth noting the speed at which Rob Lucci can do this at. Rob Lucci can use the Shigan to blitz Luffy, who is a casual lightning timer. This means that Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at speeds in excess of the speed of lightning, by a pretty substantial margin. And again, since Rob Lucci can use the Shigan at high speeds, then so two can Big Mom.
Rob Lucci can even fire off a Shigan as a projectile, and it can move at similar speeds as his close range Shigan as it was also able to tag Luffy despite Luffy and Lucci being a pretty fair distance away.
On the topic of ranged offensive attacks, Rob Lucci can also use the Rankyaku, which allows him to project a ranged cutting attack with a kick. To give you an idea for how powerful an attack this is, Rob Lucci with a CASUAL kick brought down a large building with his Rankyaku.
Rob Lucci also has techniques centered around mobility. The first one is Geppou, a technique that allows Rob Lucci to "fly" by jumping off of thin air. With this, a lesser user could move faster than Luffy could percieve, which means that Rob Lucci can move at MHS + speeds with his Geppou.
Rob Lucci also has Soru, a mobility technique that can be used more offensively. With this, the user kicks off the ground with such force that they can move at very very fast speeds. Rob Lucci was able to move FTE to Luffy, which obviously makes faster than lightning by a good degree. Both Soru and Geppou give Big Mom insane mobility on the battlefield to the point that, given her immense reaction speed and combine that with the insane travel speed afforded to her by Soru and Geppou, Big Mom will be very very hard to tag.
Now, Rob Lucci, having mastered each and every one of these techniques is granted a 7th ability: The Rokuogan. This attack allows Rob Lucci to produce a concentrated shockwave capable of dishing out insane amounts of damage.
All of these techniques goto show that Big Mom is afforded a great amount of versatility on the battlefield that my opponent's team really has no answer for.
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
This section speaks for itself. I chose the Devil Fruit of the world's strongest man for my Devil Fruit ability, and to be honest, why wouldn't I. It affords me insane AoE, DC, and is one of the most OP Devil Fruits in the One Piece story, as will be exemplified below.
For the uninitiated, a Devil Fruit is a mystical fruit that grants the eater super powers. In the case of Whitebeard, he ate the Gura Gura No Mi, allowing him to create localized earthquakes through punching.
Here, Whitebeard creates two tidal waves with a punch.
After the admiral: Aokiji steps in, freezing the tidal wave and creating two walls of glacier thick ice, Whitebeard goes onto break both structures.
But the fun doesn't stop there. Whitebeard then goes on to tilt the entire island of Marineford, destroying several buildings in the process and showcasing island level AoE.
Lastly, Whitebeard exemplifies island level DC when, while severely weakened and injured, he still manages to split the entire island of Marineford with one punch. Given the fact that Whitebeard was heavily fatigued and didn't want to hurt his crew, it is safe to say that in the hands of Big Mom, who is not restricted in this way, Big Mom would be capable of completely destroying Marineford with the Gura Gura No Mi.
When you combine Big Mom's insane physicals with the sheer power of the Gura Gura No Mi, you really have the tank to end all tanks.
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
Who else could possibly fill this role? Charlotte Katakuri boasts one of the most impressive showings of Observation Haki in the One Piece story thus far, able to see 5 seconds into future.
Now this ability has many applications, one such application being if the battle turns to CQC, as in that scenario, this ability becoms ecspeically dangerous. Here Katakuri can foresee Luffy's fighting style in the future and make counterattacks in the right places.
He also sees where Luffy will dodge his attack and attacks him there.
So so far, we have a Big Mom with an island level devil fruit, a martial art that further enhances her already impressive stats, and foresight. Combine Katakuri's Haki with Big Mom's insane reaction and travel sped and it will be EVEN HARDER for my opponent's build to tag mine. And if the battle ever turns to CQC, which it will considering Big Mom's insane travel speed, Big Mom will DOMINATE my opponent's build, combining the Rokushiki techniques with precognition
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#6
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#6
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
#6
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HitTheAssasin
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
#6
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@gearsecond659: Nicely done. I'll try to get up a response as quickly as possible(about a week).
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#7
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#7
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Thenewguysnm1
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
(6698 posts)
- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
#7
Posted by
Thenewguysnm1
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- 26 days, 9 hours ago
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Stop saying amalgam just say composite
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#8
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#8
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
#8
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HitTheAssasin
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
#8
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HitTheAssasin
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@gearsecond659: Hey, man. I'm almost done, you can expect my post in a couple of hours, I got it up as soon as possible, the day after I got home from my vacation. Sorry for the wait.
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#11
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#11
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SocaJunkie
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
#11
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SocaJunkie
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
#11
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SocaJunkie
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You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#12
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
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#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
- Show Bio
@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
#12
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@gearsecond659:Let's get this show on the road then!
Strongest Amalgam, The Body: Kurama!
Physical Abilities
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Strongest Amalgam, The Skill: Killer Bee
Killer Bee's Skill
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Strongest Amalgam, The Jutsu: Obito's Kamui
Obito's Kamui Jutsu
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Strongest Amalgam, The Kekkai Genkai: Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan
Madara's EMS
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Conclusion and Strategy
Counters to your conclusion:
Big Mom is as good a body as you can get, boasting one of the highest physicals in the One Piece verse
That is unfortunately dwarfed by the power of the Kurama Susano'o, as proven in my post.
The Rokushiki Techniques enhance her already impressive stats and give her unheard of verstatility on the battlefield
Unless in the face of my overwhelming AOE and ability to onehsot with cutting attacks on a mountain range levelling scale/
The Gura Gura No Mi gives her greater AoE and DC on the battlefield, and should be able to overwhelm my opponent's build with its island level DC
The Gura Gura No Mi's best destructive feat is dwarfed by the shockwave of the Shinsu Senjuu's attack, which the Kurama Susano'o tanked. You can't really damage me in the long run. Besides, I can simply slip through all of your attacks by virtue of Kamui and Sharing precognition to know when you're about to attack me.
Now, my counter conclusion:
- The combined durability and strength of the Kurama Susano'o dwarfs Big Mom
- A single combined and coordinated assault from the Kurama Susano'o's multi-mountain level tails and mountain range level slashes will kill your Amalgam
- Due to Killer Bee's Skill I have the ability to launch the combined and coordinated attack mentioned above
- Your Amalgam lacks the ability to severely hurt mine, who has tanked attacks far surpassing anything you have to offer in destructive capability(Hashirama's attacks, tanking the Kyuubi's attack while far weaker)
- I can easily slip through any of your attacks by virtue of Kamui+Sharingan pre-cognition to predict when you'll launch them
- You cannot dodge my attacks because they have AOE that covers hundreds of meters to kilometres of area
- You have no counter for Genjutsu GG
- You have no counter for being sucked into the Kamui dimension while you're recovering from my physical assaults
You're up again, @gearsecond659...
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
My physical body for this Amalgam CaV is the nine-tailed fox, Kurama. There are a multitude of reasons for this, but I'll start with the primary one: his physical abilities. When it comes to physical ability, there are few characters in the Narutoverse as impressive as Kurama. To provide a few examples of his impressive physical abilities that are easily comparable to even those of Big Mum, I'll start with some feats from KN1(Kyuubi-Naruto 1, referencing the number of tails Naruto has in this state) through KN8 Naruto. Yes, all of their feats are applicable to Kurama himself, as these states are merely the outcome of the 50% of Kurama's power within Naruto going out of control and possessing him. As such, even a theoretical KN9 would only be 50% of the Kyuubi's full power, since that's the amount sealed within Naruto at the time these feats were accomplished. Without further due, let's get started.
A nice feat for an incredibly small fraction of Kurama's full power in KN1 Naruto is when his strike to Orochimaru's face causes a massive shockwave that travels dozens, if not hundreds of meters and destroys several of the massive tree's present in the forest behind(remember Narutoverse tree's are huge!):
Considering the distance the shockwave traversed(hundreds of meters, loom at the size of the bridge in comparison) and the damage dealt here, I'd consider this a city-block level feat in of itself, seeing as to how it's only a side-effect from Naruto's attack on Orochimaru. In other words, a fraction of the Kyuubi's full power is capable of city-block to hill level damage with a single strike. This notion is further backed up when Naruto's rage increases further and he ascends to KN3. When Kabuto attempts to attack this KN3 Naruto, a mere roar from the latter rag dolls the superhuman ninja, sending him flying dozens of meters and destroying an entire bridge in the process:
Yet another rather impressive showing for Kurama is when KN4 Naruto defends himself against a mass of snakes launched at him by Orochimaru. To ward them off, KN4 Naruto merely waves his hand casually and the resulting shockwaves annihilates all of the reptiles and causes a massive shockwave that Yamato and Sad had to brace themselves against, despite their distance from the event:
I think these feats should suffice for showing what even a fraction of the Kyuubi's power is capable of, now I wish to show you what a bit more can do. When Naruto goes fully out of control in his battle against Pain due to Hinata getting hurt, he manifests the 8th Tail(KN8, almost 50% of the Kyuubi's power). When this happens, he's able to start forcing himself out of the Chibaku Tensei, a mountain range sized structure held together by gravity potent enough to uproot said mountain ranges:
Here's proof to show the Chibaku Tensei really was that massive:
Now, considering he didn't destroy the whole thing, but rather started breaking out of it, I'd peg this feat at small mountain level, due to the gravity involved and the size of the structure. Considering that, I'd peg the full Kyuubi at large mountain level(this was less than 50% after all), just the limit we imposed! There are of course more feats backing this up from the 50% Kyuubi and 100%.
When Naruto confronts the Kyuubi to tame its power, he attempts to overwhelm it with a Sage Art: Gargantuan Rasengan, but is blocked by 2 of Kurama's tails and then forced back, meaning, Kurama overpowered the full force of the massive Rasengan and Naruto's sage strength that was backing it, as can be seen here:
Now, as for why this is impressive: The Gargantuan Rasengan was confirmed to be mountain level by the 3rd Databook:
I understand if you're sceptical about this, since the Databook has gotten many, , many things wrong in the past. However, even if you deny it's potency as mountain level, there can be no doubt about it being at least large hill level, considering the feats other, weaker Rasengan boast(KN1's regular one was small hill level).Feats can be provided at request, but I think this is pretty straight forward. Kurama at 50% is, just like the KN8 feat confirms, at least a small mountain level character, making 100% Kurama large mountain level.
This conclusion is also backed up by the facts about the nine-tailed fox mentioned in the very first chapter of Naruto as an introduction to the beast, confirming its tails to be mountain level:
In other words, there can be no doubt: The Kyuubi at full power is a casual mountain level character in its own right physically. Honestly speaking, this is also more than enough to damage Big Mom, who has no blunt force feats to suggest she can tank repeated mountain+ level attacks from Kurama's Tails.
Now, for the Nine-Tails durability. This one is really very simple, I need only 1 feat and 2 scans to make my point.After the Juubi(Ten-Tails), a creature consisting of the combined energy of all 9 Tailed Beasts together, with such energy it can't be properly sensed by Sage Mode Naruto and such power Kurama himself admits inferiority to it, attacks the Kyuubi and punches him full-on:
Now, while I won't say he no-sold it or anything, he clearly gets up and continues to fight right away, proving Kurama is more than capable of tanking a strike from the Juubi. Why's this impressive? Well, as I said earlier, the Juubi is the combination of all 9 Tailed Beasts, has energy so great it can't be sensed, is stronger than Kurama and could casually carry mountains:
Being stronger than Kurama and unsensable(even casual mountain level characters like the Bijuu, 7th Gate Gai and Madara can be sensed with Sage Mode), as well as carrying mountains casually should prove my point about the Juubi being at the very least large mountain level, more likely multi-mountain+. In other words, Kurama's durability is even higher than his physical strength and should be in the island level range.
One last point I want to bring up is Kurama's size. Full Kurama is an absolutely massive, small mountain sized being and as such, dodging his strikes will be nigh-impossible(especially for Big Mom, she isn't very manoeuvrable), Two scans that illustrate my point about the Nine-Tails size very well are these, which should prove its size and that Big Mom won't be dodging any attacks from it:
In other words, in a confrontation of sheer power, I disagree with this statement you made in your opener:
Thus, I'd argue that Big Mom has a strength and durability advantage over Kurama and definitely has the reaction speed to be able to keep up with your team.
I disagree because the best feats you've shown for Big Mom are cancelling out attacks from Sanji and Gear 3 Luffy, who, by the feats you provided, are only large building level(destroying a metal door, really now? You can do better, Gear). However, since I know that's not the full extent of their abilities, I'll acknowledge Big Mom cancelled out 2 large hill/small mountain level(I'm being generous here) strikes with her physical strength. However, I presented proof that Kurama not only cancelled out, but overpowered a mountain level attack from Sage Mode Naruto while at 50% of his strength and using only 2 tails and rather easily at that. It's clear who holds the physical advantage here, Gear, and it's Kurama.
As for durability well, you presented little to no impressive feats in this regard. While Big Mom's durability should be at mountain+ level, I've shown Kurama taking hits from the Juubi, a multi-mountain level character and continuing to fight afterwards with no issues dwarfs anything Big Mom has done in regards to durability, despite that being her forte.
Honestly, even without the Susano'o(more on that later), Kurama possesses more than enough power to KO Big Mom with a few tail strikes, since she won't be dodging(Kami-E is of no use against city-block+ sized tails and hands striking at you).
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
Now, I think it's quite clear Killer Bee has no where near the amount of techniques or the arsenal Rob Lucci has and as such, this section likely won't be as long as the others and definitely not as long as Gears. But, nevertheless, this section has some very important points that will definitely hold relevance in the overall debate. The very first thing I want to cover is Killer Bee's skill in the use of many different weapons, which'll be very relevant in this fight, since we'll be working with 9 Tails and 2 arms. Killer Bee has great skill in the use of many weapons, with his main style using 8 at once with deadly efficiency to the point he can wield all of them with lightning precision and skill(alone not hurting himself with 8 blades at once is an impressive feat!). The extent of his ability is such that he can force back Sasuke and take him down in a sword fight quickly and with virtually no issues, despite the Uchiha's fully developed Sharingan and experience in sword fighting:
Now, Sasuke's sword skill is absolutely nothing to scoff at, quickly overwhelming him is a brilliant feat. This very same Sasuke quickly outmaneauvered Killer Bee himself while the latter was using Zabuza's Beheader just a few pages earlier in the Chapter:
Now, you're probably thinking "Huh? So Killer Bee scales to himself? Big deal". But actually, it is. Even while using Zabuza's blade, Suigetsu noted that Killer Bee's skill with it was greater than anyone else he had ever seen use it:
That would include Zabuza, who was prodigy in the ninja arts and murder, who himself had decades of experience wielding the blade. In other words, to sum it up for you, in terms of skill it goes:
Killer Bee with 8 swords > Sasuke > Killer Bee(Zabuza's sword) > Zabuza(prodigy at murder, one of the best 7 swordsman out of hundreds in a generation, highly trained ninja, decades of experience with blades)
Alone Killer Bee's ability to use Zabuza's sword so well Suigetsu was wondering how that was even possible on his very first time using or even seeing the blade speaks volumes about his skill with the blade. This is already more than enough to prove Killer Bee's incredible skill in the use of multiple weapons and why he'd be able to utilise Kurama's tails and arms perfectly for a coordinated and skillful assault, but that isn't it. Another aspect of his sword fighting is his incredible unpredictability. In his fight with Sasuke, neither Suigetsu, someone who's been training with swords for all his life, nor apparently Sasuke(despite his Sharingan) could read his movements, as was noted here:
It's heavily implied even Sasuke, despite his Sharingans ability to read movements and essentially see the future(much like Katakuri, really) cannot read Bee's movements to come. Now, I won't make the argument that this bypasses Katakuri's abilities as well, since his pre-cognition functions differently than Sasuke's, but I do see it giving him some problems. This is further backed up when Itachi, just like Sasuke, fails to counter Bee at all in CQC combat, despite his prodigious skill as a ninja:
At this point I've effectively presented Bee's skill with weapons as best I could, it's time to move onto his skill at using a Tailed Beasts ability at tails effectively. In his fight with Itachi, he quickly procures Gyuuki's hands and tentacles, using them to great effect to block Itachi's fire jutsu and catch him:
This should, in effect, prove that Bee is also skilled in using a Tailed Beasts appendages to maximal efficiency and that he'll have no issues using Kurama's tails to inflict maximum damage to your Amalgam.
Now that we've established Bee's skill with multiple weapons and unpredictability will be used to pound at your Amalgam effectively from all different sides with 11 different weapons while constantly moving and you literally can't do anything about it due to my AOE and physical advantage in the form of Kurama, let's move onto the next section.
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
This section also won't be particularly long. Just an explanation as to how exactly Kamui works and what it's limits are, a few examples of it's use straight from the manga, the speed of it's activation and it's use in this battle. I'll start it off with an explanation of the ability:
Ok, so this Jutsu is one of the most obscenely broken one's in all of Naruto and you're about to see why. It's ability functions, more or less, in a way that allows the user to become intangible at all times by transferring the body parts about to be hit by an enemies attack into another dimension and allows them to absorb other people into the Kamui dimension. The only limits to this jutsu are that one can only become intangible for 5 minutes at a time, which won't be a problem in this battle, as I'm only planning to go intangible for a couple of seconds to dodge your attacks and that, while you're intangible, you cannot absorb or attack others. That last ones a bit pesky, but easy enough to get around in my case. If that explanation wasn't good enough for you, here's Kakashi's straight from the manga:
When Obito fights against Danzo's underlings, one gets a good example of how his intangibility can be used in combat(and how it'll be used in this fight specifically), when he phases through all of there attacks and counters directly after that, showing you exactly how hard(impossible, if you ask me) it'll be for your Amalgam to even land a single hit, let alone win this fight:
- Scan 1: As you can see, Danzo's 2 Anbu's(heh) attempt to attack Obito with shurikens and a mind-body switch.To counter, Obito simply phases through the ground, temporarily disappearing.
- Scan 2: Obito reappears behind Fu(the blond one) and when the latter attempts to strike at him, he phases through the strike and intercepts it on the other side, gaining the advantage
- Scan 3: As Obito attempts to finish off Fu, Torune throws a Kunai at him, which he promptly phases through, preventing him from killing Fu
What this shows, is that, despite abusing one of the weaknesses of Kamui, Fu and Torune couldn't gain any advantages over Obito. He simply phased through all of their attacks, preventing anything they attempted to pull off. I think this encounter mirrors perfectly what Kamui will be doing in this battle. Kurama'll use it to phase through all of your offensive attacks and then use Killer Bee's skill to use the initial effect of surprise against your Amalgam, countering with devastating mountain+ level tail swings(more on this strategy later). You literally can't damage my Amalgam between Kamui and it's natural durability.
Now for the second part of Kamui, the absorption. Now, while I believe this won't be too effective in this CaV due to Katakuri's future vision and Kamui's weakness of being unable to absorb while intangible, it's still definitely worth showing. Once again, I'll use Obito's fight against Fu and Torune as an example, since it's a great showing of his capabilities:
- Scan 1: After Torune pulls off his shirt(lol), Madara has already used his phasing to go through the floor and appear behind Torune, absorbing him into the Kamui dimension before he can react. Torune's arm corrupted Obito with his before he was fully absorbed, though.
- Scan 2: Obito threw the corrupted arm at Fu, forcing him to dodge. In the time it takes him to dodge, Obito approached him and then absorbed him into Kamui before he could react.
One last thing that'll really be important in this battle is the speed of Kamui. Can I absorb you before you can do anything? Considering Big Mom's not-so-incredible combat speed, I think it may be possible even despite your incredible pre-cognition. As proof of that, this instance is probably best to illustrate the speed of the Kamui absorption/teleportation:
- Scan 1: In this scan, the important thing is that Ohnoki(Tsuchikage) uses his Particle Style on Sasuke, seemingly killing him.
- Scan 2: In this scan, we learn that Ohnoki himself thinks his Particle Style attack has surely killed Sasuke, stating it has smashed him into pieces,
- Scan 3: In this scan, we've learned that Obito has, in fact, saved Sasuke. The only way we know he could have done this(and the only one that makes sense) is if he teleported in with his Kamui and teleported away again before Ohnoki's Prticle Style could detonate. This is extremely impressive considering Ohnoki himself did not percieve Obito coming in with his Kamui and going out again.
Now that we've established all of this, Kamui will be used in this battle mainly as a way of avoiding any incoming attacks, such as a Quake from the Gura Gura No Mi and then countering with strikes from Kurama. As to how we'll know these attacks will be coming, I'll be explaining that in the next section, coming up now.
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
Now, this section is especially important and will thus be a little longer than some of the others up until now. I'll be covering all of the Sharingans abilities, from those of the 2-tomoe to the Eternal Mangekyo, from pre-cog to illusions to the Susano'o. I'll be starting with one of the most simple abilities the Sharingan grants: Pre-cognition in the form of muscle movement, as I believe this will be vital in this fight. Madara himself doesn't have any explicit showings of using this, as it's usually just taken for granted as of Shipuuden. However, we can scale from PTS Sasuke, when he obtains his 2 and 3-tomoe-Sharingan, as I don't think anyone will object to me stating Madara's Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan pre-cog should be at least equal, if not superior to PTS Sasuke's untrained 3-tomoe-Sharingan.
With that being said, lets go ahead. The best example for this ability would be Sasuke, when he first acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharinganin his fight against KNO Naruto at the end of Part 1 of Naruto. Before he acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, when Naruto attacked him after raging and going KN0, he was getting blitzed left and right, in the end, getting stomped in half a chapter:
But, when Sasuke acquired the 3-tomoe-Sharingan, the only thing that changed was that, suddenly, he was able to see Naruto's movements in advance. He explicitly states that he can now perceive Naruto's movements, despite being unable to earlier and that he can see clearly what Naruto's about to do by reading his body movements perfectly. He explicitly states he can predict and even see Naruto's future movements in advance with his eyes and react on that:
In essence, it's just Katakuri's future seeing limited only to someone's movements, but that'll suffice perfectly for this battle. As for what I'll be using this pre-cognition and advanced perception for, that's simple. With Madara's Sharingan, my Amalgam will be able to see yours attempting to move it's limbs to use a Quake on me before it's happened and thus easily activate Kamui in time, making your attacks miss. What I'm saying is: You can't and won't hit me with your quakes, I can see them in advance with the Sharingan and slip through them with Kamui, then counterattack with Kurama and the Susano'o.
Now, for the next important aspect of the Sharingan: Genjutsu. To my knowledge(which is reasonably extensive) nothing in your Amalgam gives you any resistance to telepathy in the form of advanced illusions, which the Sharingan is capable of inducing with but a glance. Too boot, this isn't something Katakuri's pre-cog'll help you against. You might be able to see your character falling into a deep sleep or being paralysed, but you'll have no idea where it's coming from or what to do about it.
Now, for some showings. Luckily, Madara has 2 Genjutsu showings of his own, so we don't have to do any scaling here. Here they are:
- Scan 1: When one of the members of the Shinobi Alliance looks into Madara's eyes, the later activates a basic Sharingan Genjutsu and despite the Chuunin presumably having been trained in anti-Genjutsu techniques(every adult ninja will probably have received this training), he is completely paralysed by the technique
- Scan 2: While the Raikage is fighting Madara's Clone Susano'o's, he makes the mistake of glancing into Madara's eyes and is put under a Genjutsu
- Scan 3: The Raikage, someone who most definitely has knowledge on anti-Genjutsu techniques, is unable to move due to being put in an illusionary technique by Madara, until the technique is released by the Tsuchikage
You have no resistance to this, so I really don't see why I can't simply put you under a Genjustu and bombard you with attacks until you die.
Now to get to the final and probably most vital of Madara's EMS powers: The Susano'o. If it wasn't already clear, the moment the battle starts(or at least shortly after it starts, it doesn't matter) my Amalgam will clad itself in the Perfect Susano'o, giving us a Kurama Susano'o, exactly what was used by Madara in the past and what I'll be drawing feats from:
I'll be quite honest with you from the beginning: Your Amalgam has no chance of winning against this, nor do I think you're taking more than one sword slash from this beast. Why do I think so? Well, lets start with some of the Susano'o and Kurama Susano'o's cutting power feats. The first and most impressive of the lot is when Hashirama attempts to attack it with his Hotei No Jutsu. To counter, the Kurama Susano'o simply swings its tails and swords, cutting all of the wooden hands and just the shockwave resulting from the attack completely blows away the tops of 6 mountains hundreds of meters away, sending the upper half flying with so much force an extra explosion is caused and they're propelled hundreds of meters upwards from their bottom halves:
It's obvious you won't be dodging this attack, looking as to how its range cover hundreds of meters to kilometres of AOE. And you aren't tanking it either, seeing as to how I know for a fact Big Mom has absolutely 0 feats or scaling to her name that would allow her to tank a cutting/piercing attack capable of multi-mountain busting with the mere shockwave(I really cannot stress this enough, it was the aftershock of the technique) of it's original force. This is a casual mountain range+ level cutting attack and no one in One Piece has the feats required to tank more than one of these swings(if I give you the benefit of the doubt). When you remember that this was just a regular swing of the sword it becomes clear that Madara can replicate both these swings and regular tail pounding, which was already mountain+ level with just Kurama, add the Perfect Susano'o to it and it becomes casual multi-mountain+, as many times as he wants, it also becomes apparent that just one serious assault from the Kurama Susano'o will reduce your Amalgam to a stain on the ground.
To present some evidence for the power of the Susano'o without Kurama, just to prove that the Tail swings would indeed increase from mountain+ to multi-mountain+ with it present, here it casually cleaves in half 2 mountains with the shockwave of it drawing its sword and creates a huge avalanche of hill sized rocks right next to it:
Add this level of power(just without the sword) to the already mountain level tails of Kurama and you get 9 times multi-mountain+ blunt force and 2 times mountain range+ level cutting power coming right at Big Mom when Kurama attacks. There won't be any dodging either, considering the are covers kilometres, as seen in both of my scans.
Now we get to durability. This is also pretty easy, once again, I'll present feats for both the Kurama Susano'o and the Susano'o without Kurama:
- Scans 1 to 3: Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attacks with its 1000 Hands, overpowering Madara's Bijuubomb spam and striking him with enough force to create a shockwave absolutely dwarfing a mountain range, a solidly island+ level attack and it's only enough to destroy half of Madara's Susano'o, leaving Kurama unscathed
- Scan 4: Madara's regular, not even perfect Susano'o tanks a a full force tail smash from a serious Kurama, controlled by BM Naruto. We've already established this to be mountain level and Madara's non-perfect Susano'o(canonically far weaker than the Perfect in every way) tanked it
Let it be noted, when I say island level in my above description of Hashirama's attack, I don't mean the sort of mini, mountain sized island that Marineford is, but a really large one. I'm just saying this before you try to say that because Hashirama broke Madara's Susano'o with his island+ level attack, Whitebeard's power can break it, because it's also island level for splitting Marineford. Marineford is not even remotely comparable to the size of the shockwave created by Hashirama's attack and I'll prove it with a direct comparison.
This is the size of Marineford, you can judge it by comparing it to the ships next to it:
This is the size of the shockwave of Hashirama's Buddha attack, best seen in comparison to the mountains and forests next to it:
Unless you think those ships next to Marineford are about as big as the forests andmountains(yeah, those little bumps are freakin' mountains)under the shockwave in the second scan(lol, they aren't even a fraction of the size), Marineford isn't even remotely the same size as the area Hashirama's attacks shockwave covered. I say this because the size of the ships compared to Marineford and the mountains compared to the shockwave are about relative. In summary:
Whitebeards Marineford splitting is in no way close to the potency of Hashirama's Shinsu Senjuu attack, meaning Whitebeard's level of "island busting"(Marineford is large mountain sized) won't cut it here.
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#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
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#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
#13
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
#13
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
Kindly delete your post, this is a CaV. Thanks.
@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
@earendill said:
Nardo stomps.
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#14
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
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#14
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HitTheAssasin
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
#14
Edited by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
I could've made a far more haxed build, he should thank me ;)
In case you didn't get the tag, just to be sure @gearsecond659
@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
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#15
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Enemybird
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#15
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Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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- 18 days, 11 hours ago
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Eww to that picture of Momma
#15
Posted by
Enemybird
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Eww to that picture of Momma
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#16
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GearSecond659
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- 18 days, 10 hours ago
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@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
- GearSecond659
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- GearSecond659
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#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 18 days, 10 hours ago
- Show Bio
@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 18 days, 10 hours ago
- Show Bio
@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
#16
Posted by
GearSecond659
(4358 posts)
- 18 days, 10 hours ago
- Show Bio
@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
What can I say. I prefer to stick with the basics LMAO
@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
@socajunkie said:
You have the hax express on the Naruto side and you go for Whitebeard’s Devil Fruit? Disappointing.
- Chronicplane
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
(7157 posts)
- 18 days, 9 hours ago
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Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
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- Chronicplane
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Forum Posts: 7157
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#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
(7157 posts)
- 18 days, 9 hours ago
- Show Bio
Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
(7157 posts)
- 18 days, 9 hours ago
- Show Bio
Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
#17
Posted by
Chronicplane
(7157 posts)
- 18 days, 9 hours ago
- Show Bio
Tag for every post please, Interested to see how Gear is gonna deal with the Haxfest on his opponents side.
- HitTheAssasin
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#18
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 13 days, 13 hours ago
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@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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#18
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 13 days, 13 hours ago
- Show Bio
@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
#18
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 13 days, 13 hours ago
- Show Bio
@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
#18
Posted by
HitTheAssasin
(6433 posts)
- 13 days, 13 hours ago
- Show Bio
@gearsecond659: Just a tag to see whether you saw my post was up. Don't want you to miss it!
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