• Current Arrow vs pit-lusted Speedy (blood-lust in full effect)


• Melee fight: Oliver has his bow, Thea has a sword


• Morals off


• Fight to K.O or death

Who wins?

Oliver

With the Pit-Bloodlust, I can see a case being made for Thea

Ollie snaps her neck but only because this is morals off.

Ollie.

Thea is a solid tier or two below Oliver.

The Sword gives her an advantage, but still Oliver.

Ends in se- wait nevermind.

Thea gets stomped

Bloodlusted Thea beat Anarky twice [Stomped the first time] who stomped Ollie and still gave him a fight after Ollie surpassed him. No way is Ollie stomping.

OT-Ollie in the fight of his life.

@slade-prime: @angeljax: @tonymartial: @_kingoflatveria: @rbt:

You guys are seriously underestimating Thea. Starting unarmed, she literally stomped an armed Anarky in 12 seconds, disarming him and tagging him 9 times during that period, while he couldn't even touch her once. Anarky has just beaten S4 Green Arrow, with Oliver being unable to tag him a single time. Anarky has consistently outperformed Oliver during S4, sometimes when Oliver even had a teammate.

Oliver stomps

@riddlerfan77: When was the second time Anarky beat Oliver?

4X02 and 4X10 the latter time when Ollie had help. Ollie's surpassed him though as is evidenced by 5X01.

@riddlerfan77: Anarky is singlehandly the most inconsistent fighter in the Arrowverse, and even for Arrow that's saying a lot.

Anarky beat Thea the first time they fought and gave her a ton of trouble before losing, the second time. Oliver stomped him in S5 because that's when he started cutting the B.S and stopped holding back like he was in S4. Thea is "supposedly" Meryln level (which I disagree with) but Oliver surpassed him seasons ago and he's literally no longer a threat to him.

I don't see this match going on for more than minute tbh, if Oliver is going all out.

Oliver.

Ollie

@riddlerfan77:

Nope Savage still holds that mantle.

I had street-level characters in mind but, yeah. Savage is just as bad.

False actually, he got stomped the first time because she was bloodlusted, embarrassed her twice the second time [One shotting her on her own and putting down her+Ollie], lost to her the third time because she was pissed off and won the fourth time when she had help from Ollie and Diggle. He stomped Ollie three times but Ollie surpassed him by the time of season five. He's not inconsistent at all you're just ignoring context.

Let's see, so Anarky went from stomping Thea, to stomping Oliver that hasn't "surpassed" him yet (which is an absurd claim since it implies that Oliver wouldn't have been better than him until S5 and indirectly implies that Thea > Oliver since Thea beat Anarky when Oliver didn't) fought Thea, Oliver and Diggle at once, and then lost to Thea.

There's no consistency. And even then, Thea only beat Anarky when she was pissed off and/or bloodlusted. Which isn't telling of her normal levels. I know she's bloodlusted but I don't think it's that big of a boost.

Did you not read the op. Normal Thea is Merlyn level, bloodlusted Thea stomped Anarky.

Yeah, and I'm saying that normal Thea isn't even Merlyn level and having bloodlust from the Lazarus pit isn't that huge of a buff, as I've already said.

@riddlerfan77

Just one question:

Did you think this encounter counted as a win for Thea?

@angeljax: Yes but a circumstantial one.

Oliver

@angeljax: What is your argument for Thea not being Merlyn-level?

@bladeoffury: We've already gone at it in the other thread. I see no evidence in Thea's in-universe portrayal as a fighter, her showings against fodder/established characters, or her accolades, statements and accomplishments to suggest that she has reached Merlyn's level. Let alone surpassed him.

Thea has a weapon that can one-shot Oliver. She takes this.

You've dropped the debate in the other thread.

Agree or disagree:

• Thea beat Malcolm in the Arrow cave


• AoS Framework feats are legit


• Anarky is a tier above Merlyn

Just say "agree" or "disagree" to each of the above points.

@bladeoffury:

Agree, but I honestly don't feel Malcolm was trying his hardest.

Agree, because it was constructed by Darkhold technology and was made specifically to mimic reality to a tee. Down to every molecule, air current, and minuscule detail. Compared to the "Dreamworld" which was rendered by the memories of Oliver/Sara/Thea/Ray. That statement isn't very reliable or feasible. But I won't discount what Thea accomplished there.

Disagree atm. I'd have to re-examine Anarky's feats.

@angeljax:

Agree, but I honestly don't feel Malcolm was trying his hardest.

He had every reason to. He fully believed that Dahrk would succeed, and his only goal was to save Thea and himself. To do that, he would have to help Dahrk, or in that case, obtain the idol. That wouldn't be possible if Thea won.

So, Malcolm was basically fighting for both his and his daughter's life, which is a better motivation than most of his other ones, such as mass murder or leadership of the LoA.

Malcolm might have held back a bit (involuntarily) because it's his daughter, but that becomes a moot point when we consider that Thea held back just as much (also involuntarily) because it's her father. The difference is that Thea's reluctance to go full out was actually highlighted in that fight, with her being unable to finish Malcolm off.

Agree, because it was constructed by Darkhold technology and was made specifically to mimic reality to a tee. Down to every molecule, air current, and minuscule detail. Compared to the "Dreamworld" which was rendered by the memories of Oliver/Sara/Thea/Ray. That statement isn't very reliable or feasible. But I won't discount what Thea accomplished there.

If the characters in the Dreamworld didn't doubt their existence for an entire lifetime, the Dreamworld is pretty accurate. But since you admitted that the fight's legit, I won't argue.

Disagree atm. I'd have to re-examine Anarky's feats.

His fights against named characters:

• 
  vs Oliver: Oliver was going practically full-out in his first fight with Anarky. He just saw his sister get electrocuted, and he knows how dangerous Anarky is. This is supported by Oliver's lack of hesitation when he shot an arrow and threw a flechette at his opponent, things that would kill most enemies. Oliver couldn't land a single hit on Machin, while the latter tagged him 5 times, finally defeating him with electrocution


• vs Thea: Takes place right after his fight with Oliver. An unarmed, pit-lusted Thea intercepts Lonnie's attempt to finish Oliver off, and the two engage in a fight. Despite Machin's reach advantage provided by his weapon, Thea tags him 9 times in 12 seconds, disarms him, and sets him on fire with his own weapon.


• 
  vs Oliver and Thea: Oliver and Thea (not pit-lusted) were going full out against Anarky, attacking from different sides at the same time. He knocked them both down and escaped.


• vs Thea: Takes place right after his fight with Oliver and Thea. He surprises Thea by escaping from his bonds pressuring her for a couple of seconds and taking her out in a single kick.


• vs Oliver, Diggle, and Thea: Can't find the video, Lonnie held them off briefly before escaping.


• 
  vs Thea: An unarmed Thea was fighting an armed Anarky for her boyfriend's life. They fought evenly for a bit, she maintained the upperhand briefly, he knocked her aside and killed her boyfriend. A raging Thea then disarmed him, beat him with his own weapon, and knocked him out.


• 
  vs Oliver: Opening of season 5. Starting unarmed and picking up two crowbars in the middle of the fight, Anarky holds his own against Oliver before losing. He managed to tag him multiple times as well as disarm him.

Oliver, and it’s not close